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Home Forums Alpha Test Alpha 6 feedback, bugs, & suggestions

This topic contains 14 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by  Fureniku 4 months, 1 week ago.

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#69153
Fureniku
Moderator

So, I’ve recently hit 500 hours total for Alpha – about 220 of which are in Alpha 6. I figured as it’s been a while, it’s time for my second feedback post!
Strap in, I’ve got a lot to talk about, so I’ll try and be organized about it a bit.

FOOD
My first feedback relates to food. I really like the food system for healing, but there are a couple of consideration points here.
– Too many berries!
Berries are currently way too common in my opinion. I suppose it’s a realistic amount to get from a full tree, but they fill up your inventory really quickly… on one mining expedition I managed to get a shipping container 2/3rds full with them. I think 2-3 per tree would probably be a bit better.
– Eating in motion
Currently, you must stand still in order to eat – which is good. Personally, I’d like it if we could walk, similar to when placing a shipyard – but stationary works fine. However, you can still eat while swinging, or even when gliding – and you have full movement control while gliding. I assume that last part is probably a bug – but it would probably be a bit more balanced for player combat if you had to be grounded to eat.
– Healing amounts
If I’m honest, I’ve never tested the thuntomite steak – but from what I’ve seen manta steak and thuntomite stew heal the same amount, at the same rate. Considering the higher cost of thuntomite stew, it’s just not worth making them.
Plus, a single berry can heal a full 50% of your bar – considering how easy they are to get (even with my above change to drop rate), they might be more balanced giving just 10 or 20. To add to that, healing bonuses could stack (So if you ate three berries at once, you’d heal 30 over the total period).
– Camp Fires seem rare
I’ve found a lot more recipes for the actual cooking than I have for the camp fire. I actually didn’t get the camp fire until last out of all of them, and I’d seen multiple others until then (Especially thuntomite steaks).
– BUG: Campfires don’t always work
I’ve had a glitch a couple of times where my player doesn’t register a nearby campfire, and thus I can’t cook my food. I can’t reliably reproduce it, unfortunately, but moving far away and returning, respawning, and relogging didn’t fix it. It’s simply as if the fire doesn’t exist.

SHIPS & SHIP BUILDING
– World Height
Naturally, there needs to be a vertical limit. However, I’d like to see this varying depending on your ship. Each additional core could give you a few hundred meters more ascension capabilities. This has an initial benefit that you can easily out-fly a griefers platform that they’re using to simply board you – but also in the future could lead to late-game areas which are simply located higher up (potentially in the earlier biomes – giving a reason to return back there)
– Core Resilience
Currently, it’s pretty easy to take a ship down by destroying its core. Obviously, the core should be a primary target, but it seems a bit too easy. One simple idea could be to just make cores stronger. We experimented a while ago and you can destroy a ship’s core with 5 timed explosives. Of course, in Closed Beta they are harder to craft, but five is still enough that a lone griefer can hop on your ship and take it out without any problems.
The flipside, however, is cannons actually take notably longer to destroy a core with direct hits. It’s almost like the two damage ratios need to be swapped – direct shots from a cannon should do considerably more damage than a puny explosive, in my opinion.
– Alternative explosives
Another idea I had regarding ship PvP was different options for explosives. Currently, we have the timed one, which is pretty cool – but I’d really like to see a sort of breach charge. These could maybe be stacked (when timed no longer can), but would only be useful on ship paneling (and doors, when implemented). The idea being, they’re a way to get into an armoured ship, but can’t be used to just kill all the crates and sink the core in seconds.
They would need careful consideration to keep balanced though. Personally, I’d like them to be remote detonation (with very limited range; roughly nameplate range), but I’m not sure how others would feel about that (@Strite strongly disagreed :P)
– Panelling
Currently, panels are a very odd size. This was a problem in Alpha 5 too, but there are a number of issues with panels.
Firstly, a panel isn’t the same size as a deck’s maximum height. This means you’re pretty much forced to either have Z-fighting, or a gap. In some cases, you can get away with it, but for example on this ship, we had to panel from both sides which look quite odd;

(Note that upper panel actually goes above the deck beam too – not always possible to do)
Also, large metal panels are quite a different size to large wooden panels. Was this intentional?
– Windows
I had a cool idea that could make windows a lot more… usable. Currently, due to their square shape and their size, they can be challenging to place without huge ugly gaps on a lot of designs. My idea is simple – instead of having a dedicated window panel, simply have a window “hole puncher”. You could apply it to any point on any panel and it would simply create a window at that position. This way we get our windows in ideal positions, and we could even have multiple holes together for larger windows or even doorways.
– Cannon Cooldown
The cooldown on an overheated cannon leaves you pretty much dead in the water. I like the idea of cannons overheating, but it feels like they’re overheated for a very long time. It might be better if we can tell that we’re close to overheating (maybe a smoke effect?), or had some sort of method to cool them quickly, but having a cannon out of action for minutes on end pretty much kills you in a fight πŸ˜›
– Render Range
Obviously, there are performance problems with ships rendering too far away – but the odd thing is, they render super far away vertically. It seems we can see a ship up to 5,000m away on the vertical axis, but horizontally it’s closer to 500m (although it’s harder to tell). On top of that, the higher up you go, the closer a ship has to be to you in order to render, leading to ships de-rendering almost within gliding range by the time you’re at the world height. I’m sure many people would agree a more spherical render range would be preferable – IE simply being able to see ships within X in any direction. I’ve noticed players who currently use this render range to their advantage in PvP, which in my opinion is a little exploitative. On top of that, I’ve successfully hit an enemy ship with a cannon while it wasn’t even rendered (confirmed by watching their stream) – just to give a true feel to how close you have to be πŸ˜›
– Frame sinking
I love the frame sinking feature – a really nice touch that adds a spice of life to islands you visit. My only suggestion for it would be that the speed of sinking could change based on the material it is sinking into. The current speed works pretty well for something like grass, for example, but I feel it should be a bit faster if the frame is sat on sand. Likewise, it could be slower when sat on stone or a structure.
– Core shard costs
Another possibly unpopular opinion, but I think the main sky core should cost more than one shard. Most players would get more than one while mining the materials to be able to build their ship anyway. It would also discourage throwaway ships designed to only be used for a matter of minutes.
– Shipyard docking
This is more of a suggestion for a planned feature than actual feedback. In the next update, apparently, our shipyards will be “locked” to us to the point where players not associated can’t even use the helm or chests, etc. While this is a great idea, it does have one fatal flaw – when a ship is docked, framerates drop.
My idea thus is simple – add an “anchor” mode to a shipyard, which keeps a ship docked and does all of the above without it being in edit mode. Hopefully, that would stop the ship generating frame rate issues compared to if it was just hovering as normal. To keep it as a useful feature even after these frame issues are fixed (I.E. it’s not just a bug band-aid), only the shipyard creator can toggle editing/anchor mode, but when in anchor mode anyone associated with the yard can still interact with the ship. This would let you allow players onboard to use your chests while docked without having to give them full access so they can rip out your core, or whatever.

PLAYER & ISLANDS
– Schematics
I saw another feedback post which suggested players should only be able to learn a schematic at the tier they have already unlocked – I.E. they can only learn a Tier 3 wing if they’ve unlocked Tier 3 wings from the knowledge tree. While I’m sure some players will disagree with that, I think it’s a really good idea to keep progression balanced and to encourage team play and even trade.
Also, as a personal note, it would be really nice to know how the component will look before it’s created. Obviously, stats always come first, but with two similar schematics, the looks could decide it!
– Loot bags are heavy!
Back in Alpha 5, there were a couple of times a loot bag had fallen off a ship or island, and I had managed to dive after it, grab the contents, then glide to safety. However, in Alpha 6, I’ve had a similar situation only to watch the bag shoot at supersonic speed into the void. Surely a loot bag should be notably lighter than a player, and thus I should be able to catch up with it? πŸ™‚
– Ores despawn very quickly
Considering the persistence of the world, ores ejected from a node core despawn very quickly – roughly 30 seconds after dropping. I’ve actually missed ores because of this before when they’ve rolled down a hill or similar. Personally, I’d like it if they would stay in existence until the understorm next hits. This would also encourage alternative mining tactics, such as parking a large ship under a cluster of nodes and dropping all the precious ore to the ship, where it can be collected in bulk later.
– Atlas Shard stacking
It seems a bit odd to me that shards only stack to 10, while the end-game schematics cost 15. Could shards possibly stack up to 15 as well?
– Health Bar
It would be nice if the health bar changed colour as you approached death. I’ve seen a lot of people on stream who didn’t even realise they were down to below 30 health, so something a little more eye-catching would be nice.
– First person jitter
It seems that the camera is locked to the players head when in first person. That’s a pretty standard thing, however, when we make small movements the character tends to bob their head a bit, which jitters the camera in quite a notable way. I’ve actually found this gives more motion sickness than when I’ve managed to keep first person in high-speed grapples (which didn’t give me any sickness at all, by the way :P)
I’d also really like to be able to see the players body while in first person. Just having a floating tool seems a little immersion breaking to me, personally.

And finally, a few generic bugs. I’ve experienced all of these in-game and they’re probably known, but I’ve not directly seen them reported – so I’m just noting them in case they’re not known.
– Atlas lifters are very erratic
Step 1: Put an atlas lifter on the thing
Step 2: Try and move the thing
Step 3: Observe the thing being weird – either moving too quickly or not at all.

– Stormwall RNG is evil
Sometimes, you can fly through a stormwall with no issues – and others with the exact same ship, it’ll rip you to pieces in seconds. I assume this isn’t intentional… πŸ˜›

– Shipyards not registering stuff as inside them
A pretty common issue but I’ve never seen it mentioned in an official light. Often if you go out of range of your shipyard for a minute (eg, mining) or die and respawn, you won’t be able to interact with anything. You’ll get a red box around anything you aim at with the error “out of range of your shipyard.” The current fix is to relog (only works sometimes), or create a new shipyard entirely.

– Sometimes frames bug and do not lose weight with removed parts
I haven’t been able to reliably reproduce this, but occasionally you’ll take something off your frame, and it will totally vanish into thin air. On top of that, the weight of the object isn’t removed from your frame.
There is no known fix beyond getting an entirely new frame. You’re now stuck with dead weight – relogging, letting your ship relog and even server maintenance don’t make the part reappear or your ship lighter.

– Occasionally, ships will drift endlessly at a very slow speed.
I’m not sure why, but it happens. Ships will just drift very very slowly away from where you parked them. This could lead to bigger issues though – for example, if you’re close to the edge of the world it could drift out and destroy itself, or if it drifted into an island there’s a chance a storm could hit and register it as a sinking frame. Or, of course, it’s simply too far to get all your freshly-mined materials on board!

Thanks for reading! If you actually read the whole thing, you deserve a cookie. Go get yourself a cookie!
I hope my feedback and ideas are useful. Here’s to another 500 hours!

#69165
Strite
Keymaster
Staff
Staff

Great feedback buddy, agree with almost all of this (except remote charges, but we’ve been through that already πŸ˜› )

#69179
Lavayar
Participant

Good job!

– Sometimes frames bug and do not lose weight with removed parts.
Had that bug too with power generators. One of them disappeared after passing stormwall. But ship weight didn’t change and fuel gauge showed capacity including missing one. Actually it was operating normally and can be even refueled. Relogging, ship relog and even server maintenance hadn’t help.

#69180
Tyrendian
Participant

So probably the model just glitched out. Did you test if the collider is still in place? But holy crap one of the best feedback posts I’ve ever seen, and I see them rather often. πŸ˜€ I kind of want to report this thread for usefulness, is that possible in this forum?

#69183
Strite
Keymaster
Staff
Staff

I kind of want to report this thread for usefulness, is that possible in this forum?

Sadly not but rest assured Bossa have read this thread πŸ˜‰

#69189
herb
Keymaster
Staff
Staff

Some thoughts:

Eating while moving: We can mess around with the rules on eating, I agree!
General food numbers balancing: There’s going to be a lot more tweaking of numbers in Closed Beta.

Varying altitude: We’ve talked internally about tying your max altitude to the number of shipcore addons the ship has, but there are some problems with that. The biggest one is the resulting griefing potential: imagine an experienced player with all or almost all core upgrades coming into the Wilderness, flying above new players, doing whatever they like, with no real possibility of the new players retaliating. A big part of the formula for discouraging griefing is forcing the attacker to risk something as well, which an out-of-reach ship bypasses. But there are some longterm plans blowing about for islands at different altitudes.

Breaching charges: I really like the idea of some explosives only doing damage to structural ship parts.

Panels: Panels are not really a complete feature, unfortunately! We have plans to have some more random variance, and even quality-of-life features like being able to craft a stack that you can pick up once and place consecutively.

Window-puncher: This would require a bit of technical wizardry, as how game physics is done would require us to procedurally generate colliders as you punch holes. Not impossible, but for its benefit probably not something we’ll do in the short-to-medium term.

Cannon overheat – This is one of those cases where we started with real-life formulas for heat dissipation etc., but it turns out it’s not that fun! So during work for Closed Beta we’ve changed the formula to be less realistic but more fun.

Ship horizontal render range – This is a known issue, but requires some serious technical reworking. We want to fix this, but it will require some time.

Frame sinking material-dependent – Possible, though there are other things tied to sinking/deterioration that are going to come first, and then we’ll reevaluate!

Shipyard docking – Can you send a description of the framerate issue to CS? Docked ships should absolutely not be more expensive to render than a free-floating ship. Regarding the anchor mode, perhaps we may need that, but it does add another layer of complexity for newer players building their first ship with their friends. I’d like to see how the new locking works before second-guessing it.

Schematics – We’re a little leery of tying TOO much into the Knowledge tree, especially because the most important functionality of the Knowledge tree hasn’t been talked about publicly (as far as I recall) yet. With that feature in, we really shouldn’t need to put even more of a benefit on the tree. Regarding previewing, we’ve had a plan for a long time for replacing the generic icon in the middle of the crafting screen with a dynamic preview of the object itself. Hope we can get to it soon!

Heavy loot bags – Did not know this. Strange bug – have other players noticed this?

Metal scrap despawning – This is a bug. Also never heard of this – can other players confirm?

Atlas shards stacking is an easy thing we can tweak, but we have plans for additional things that will require shards to craft. Right now they’re mostly useless after you’ve built all your core addons.

Health bar – I don’t think we’ll make the color dynamic, but we should probably change the color back to red. Low health used to trigger a screen effect (kind of like this other cool game *cough* Surgeon Simulator *cough*) – does that sound like it’d help?

First person – First person mode is very rough around the edges right now! Wasn’t even really planned. Treat it as a proof of concept for now.

Atlas lifter bug – That’s actually a bug with incorrect forces being applied through the rope. We’re looking into it for Closed Beta.

Stormwall RNG – I don’t think we’ve talked about this before, but I’m gonna spill the beans – surprisingly, it IS intentional… sort of. There was a whole feature where there would be pockets of lightning within stormwalls that a skilled pilot would be able to navigate around. Turns out it was too difficult to see where they were or to even maneuver around them, but they didn’t get removed for Alpha 6. So that’s what’s been happening. They’ve been removed for Closed Beta, but we want to get them back in later, when we can make them more visible and a viable and fun mechanic. (And also nerf them a bit.)

Shipyards not registering – To clarify, are you saying that you seem to lose registration with your shipyard if you travel too far away? Can you describe this in more detail? What happens when you interact with the shipyard itself? This would be a serious bug given the new shipyard ownership feature.

Frames not registering removed parts – I believe this bug has been fixed for Closed Beta.

Ships drifting forever – I believe this has also been fixed for Closed Beta.

Big thanks for the feedback, Fureniku, and keep it coming!

#69191
Fenix
Moderator

Thanks for the info, @Herb-Liu!

On the subject of windows, I’m curious if that kind of mechanic might be easier to do for deck paneling? Since decks are always flat I imagine the collides would be much simpler to deal with. I had similar suggestions for that not too long ago. πŸ™‚

#69195
Loroseco
Participant

I can confirm the shipyard docking issue, it’s noticeable even with a beefy PC. I can also confirm the metal scrap despawn bug and heavy loot bag bug. I’ve nearly lost ships to loot bags on a couple of occasions.

A visual effect for damage taken / low health would be much appreciated!

re: the shipyard bug. I have had this a few times. This happens to me most when I place a shipyard, then move out of range of it in order to guide my ship in. It has only happened to me if I place the shipyard and then move out of range before first interacting with it. If you interact with the shipyard once the bug happens, it acts as if it belongs to you. However you are unable to move any attached or unattached items in the shipyard range. Relogging or moving to a new shipyard has fixed this issue every time for me.

#69197
Lavayar
Participant

Heavy loot bags – Did not know this. Strange bug – have other players noticed this?

Metal scrap despawning – This is a bug. Also never heard of this – can other players confirm?

Confirming both

#69199
Fureniku
Moderator

Wow, thanks for the huge reply @herb-liu

Varying altitude – that makes sense. I never considered the point of griefers.

Panels – I really like that idea of being able to consecutively place them! It would also be nice to have a bit more precision somehow – hanging from a shipyard bubble trying to place can be a little frustrating – although I’m not sure of a good way to stabilise yourself without breaking immersion. (Personally, I stand on a scrap wing if it’s really bugging me :P)

Shipyard docking – not sure what CS is? But regardless, here’s video 1 of 3 that I took for this reply! Thanks to @strite for using the Cutter for this – certainly one of the more serious examples of the issue.

Heavy Loot Bags:

Metal ore despawn:

Health bar – I love that idea of having a visual effect – it should help people a lot more πŸ™‚

Stormwall RNG – Interesting. I had actually noticed that there are certain spots on the wall which seem to flash more when looking at it from the outside. I had assumed maybe there was a ship in that area – but maybe it’s actually those pockets of lightning instead. I guess we could find by sheer luck a “safe passage” through walls for the sake of alpha 6, we’ll have to experiment.

Shipyard registration – This is a little harder to reproduce (and sort of hard to describe), so I can’t get a video of it right now. I build ships quite a lot, so next time it happens I’ll grab it on shadowplay and add it to the thread.

#69220
Tyrendian
Participant

I am slapping this in here because I dont think it deserves an own thread:

Why not use the Atlas Shards for weapon crafting, giving them some additional features, or even a standalone, highend cannon?

Tesla Gun – shock damage
Repulsor Gun – random kinetic force applier (this might get abused A LOT :D)

#69232
Strite
Keymaster
Staff
Staff

To add to @fureniku‘s last post, here’s a video of the shipyard bug as requested. Language not SFW, you’ll have to excuse my venting, I was getting a bit pissy after a multitude of things going wrong πŸ˜›

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYCbFZ2k4B8

#69234
Tyrendian
Participant

It says private video.

probably, because I am not logged in right now and the PC cant tell my age.

#69269
Sethodine
Participant

The suggestions about food got me thinking… what if some food (stew?) had great buffs but you had to eat it while sitting, while other foods (a sandwhich?) had lesser buffs but could be eaten while walking/grappling/etc? On the one hand, it seems kinda silly, but on the other hand I can’t really think of any other game that divided food by how practical it was to try and eat it on the go πŸ˜›

#69301
Fureniku
Moderator

Frames not registering removed parts – I believe this bug has been fixed for Closed Beta.

We’ve actually just learned something new with this bug that’s very interesting.

I’m sure some people have experienced what we call the “Rodeo Bug” – where as soon as you try and move a ship, it starts acting crazy and spinning out of control. As it turns out, this is actually being caused by the same bug.

I added the bug to my list after it happened to me for a second time on Saturday, and then my ship got the rodeo bug but I never thought anything of it. (Note; the first time it happened, I ended up never flying the ship). Today, the bug happened to Strite, and his ship got the rodeo bug too. That’s when it hit me that the two were related.
We docked it and tried to remove the deck that the cannon in question was attached to. As expected, we couldn’t remove the panel because it had “parts attached”. We shot it until it broke off, and the deck scuttled away as if it was possessed πŸ˜›

Sure enough, straight after that, the ship worked absolutely fine. Thus, the rodeo bug was cured!
Obviously, if it’s fixed for Closed Beta, then it’s not a huge thing anymore, but I figured this was useful in case someone else happened to get the bug between now and then. I’m sure Strite will post the video of it all tomorrow πŸ™‚

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